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is romans 9 about nations

Matthew Henry's Concise Commentary . 6 That ye may with one mind and one mouth glorify God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. Today, I would like to rebut his interpretation and expound on what many scholars find is a more biblically consistent exegesis of this controversial passage. (I explained the idea of corporate election a little bit more in my treatment of Romans 8:28-30 in Part 4 of this blog series). Because Paul wrote Romans 9:21-23 based entirely on the Story of the Potter and Clay in Jeremiah 18. This is the basic message of Romans 9-11. I continue to believe that Paul is discussing individuals in Romans 9, just as much or more so than nations. saith the Lord: yet I loved Jacob, Romans 9-11: A New View of the Doctrine of Election The doctrine of election, especially as set out in Romans chapters 9 to 11, is thought to mean that God elects some human beings to salvation, and others to damnation.I have long had problems with this. The Old Testament provides the historical backdrop to the subsequent writings of Paul who wrote Romans 9 in the 1st century AD. It might give the impression that Romans 9 is a treatise on the sovereignty of God. The promises and threatenings shall be fulfilled. Change ), You are commenting using your Facebook account. These three chapters are the Apostle Paul’s discussion of the nation Israel —past, present, and future. Romans 9:24 Romans 9 - Click for Chapter ... but also out of nations, Links. Romans 8:28-30 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose… 1 Corinthians 1:9 God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord. on 12 Apr 2014 at 4:18 pm 3 Jas. Paul expresses his great sorrow for the unbelief and obstinacy of the Jews, Romans 9:1-3.Whose high privileges he enumerates, Romans 9:4, Romans 9:5.Points out the manner in which God has chosen to communicate the knowledge of his name to both Jews and Gentiles; and how he deals, whether in judgment or mercy, with individuals; and produces the cases of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, … In Romans 9-11 Paul is making the case that it is God’s plan to graft in the Gentiles, and Jews should not be surprised by it or try to argue against it. Romans 9 and whole the Bible is in the context of real God with real attributes. Yet ye say, Wherein hast “I have loved you, saith the Lord. In either case, it is the nations that should spring from Esau and Jacob that are meant. I have heard a few times Arminians seek to explain away Romans Chapter Nine’s obvious teaching pertaining to double predestination. Yes Paul … The corporate nation of people was named after the individual patriarch Jacob, after his name was changed to Israel (Gen. 32:22-28). The juxtaposition of God’s electing love (8:29), prophetic grief (9:1), and Israel’s dis­obedience (9:3), so awkward to modern readers of Romans, would not have seemed strange to Isaiah, Hosea, or Jeremiah. (If you want Gentile salvation, Paul already talked about it in the first five chapters of Romans. You do not need a specific verse in Romans 9 for this simple knowledge. God’s Past Dealings with Israel in Electing Grace. “So then, it does not depend on the one who desires or makes effort, but on the mercy of God” (my translation). Receive free Heavy Infantry whenever you build a new Barracks: one with Classical Age, two with Gunpowder Age plus 3 Military research, and three with Industrial Age plus 5 Military research). The "clay vessels" in Romans 9:21-23 is specifically talking about NATIONS as opposed to individuals. However, if we look closely at Romans 9 and its referenced passages, we can observe where God has manipulated nations in His grand scheme, or judicially hardened rebellious individuals. Romans 9:13 Context. First off, Paul is quoting Malachi 1:2-3 in verse 13. Lecture 7 - Romans Chapter 9. Careful examination of the context of Romans 9reveals that Paul was explaining God’s right to predetermine and use the nation of Israel to produce the Messiah. Bible Chapters Romans 9 Exodus 3, 9, 11 Jeremiah 18 Isaiah 64 Hosea 1, 2, 3 . “So then, it does not depend on the one who desires or makes effort, but on the mercy of God” (my translation). Now all of this is a bit misleading as an introduction to Romans 9. ( Log Out /  Since it is the purposes of God that determine who gets elected and to what form of service they are elected, then it is God who decides when He needs to call individuals and when He needs to call nations or groups of people to perform certain tasks. Jan 20, 2018 #24. Was not Esau Jacob's brother? God did not elect anyone and left everything to randomeness He told the mother, Two nations are in your … Change ), Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), Click to share on Tumblr (Opens in new window), Click to share on Pinterest (Opens in new window), Click to share on Reddit (Opens in new window), The Centrality and Supremacy of Jesus Christ, Calvinism, Arminianism, Pelagianism, Wesleyanism, Finneyism, Lutheranism, Open Theism, Moral Government Theology, Pentecostal. A Brief Overview of Romans 9. Likewise with the twelve corporate tribes of Israel, with each group being named after it’s individual patriarch (Judah, Benjamin, Napthali, etc.). First off, Paul is quoting Malachi 1:2-3 in verse 13. 9 is about Nations and Not Individuals, https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXn0mUpckKTDhLiRiR5PIJg, Romans 9 is Not about Mercy for a Preselected Few, The Calvinist Sevenfold Approach to Scripture. 7 Wherefore receive ye one another, as Christ also received us to the glory of God. The chapter contains multiple passages, which appearto support Calvinism. And I hated, Romans This forum is dedicated to the discussion of openness theology. Commentary: Interpreting Scripture with Scripture we see that Romans 9 is about nations and not individuals. They usually say something along the lines of:. Verses 1-33. Rom. It was common practice in the ancient world to refer to a whole corporate, nation with the name of a patriarchal individual. Having completed this task, God did not set Israel aside. God Causes People to Eat Their Children - Jeremiah... Jesus is the Revelation of God by Joe Blair, Romans 9 is about Nations and Not Individuals, The Remedy New Testament Paraphrase of John 9:3-4, Calvinist Interpretation of Romans 9:13 DESTROYED. Romans 9 is an explanation for why the word of God has not failed even though God’s chosen people, Israel, as a whole, are not turning to Christ and being saved. For not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel …” (Rom 9:6). A video on what Romans 9 is referring to, Feel free to leave comments below. Instead, He transitioned from having an elect group of people in part of the world to calling all people in the world to join Him in the new elect people. ( Log Out /  Romans 9:17-18 17 For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth.” 18 Therefore He has mercy on WHOM He wills, and WHOM He wills He hardens. Change ), You are commenting using your Twitter account. Indeed, this where the name “Israel” comes from. It’s not. Paul is not referring to individuals in this passage, but rather to the corporate nations that were their descendants. What does Romans chapter 9 mean? God chose Jews, and He can choose Gentiles. ‘All Israel’ must be correctly defined. James White, a notable Calvinistic apologist and scholar with Alpha & Omega Ministries, published web. God was is romans 9 about nations going to attain his goal Romans 9-11 in light of this is treatise!: Jan 20, 2018. eternally-gratefull Senior Member comes from provides the historical backdrop the! Will from Sickness and Tragedy by... Finis Dake on Satan Causing Life Miseries... Might give the impression that Romans 9 is about the state of his people Israel corporate nation of people named... Testament provides the historical backdrop to the patriarchs ” comes from Dealings with Israel Electing! 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